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Well that's the thing. Massimo runs the place, GCM helps... the factory has leaders. The problem is that these leaders aren't the guy with the wallet. Massimo can rally the troops and get the job done like none other, but he doesn't manage finances for Paul G. Stoddart. No one is going to blame Paul for wanting to spend his own money. I would never entrust anyone to run my business completely unaided by me. What we will blame him for is that he's never there to spend it.
How about the Yank-loving Fennian, what's his version?
This thread has gone on way too long. Get over it.
Oh Lease Stop banging the Kangaroos. Look for a more fullfilling relationship It's sure to give you a better outlook on life. (I'm not talking about moving on to sheep either)
Oh Lease Stop banging the Kangaroos. Look for a more fullfilling relationship It's sure to give you a better outlook on life. (I'm not talking about moving on to sheep either)
Is it me, or does this style seem somehow familiar?? Could we have found smarT aleC ?????
It has not gone on too long.
I am well mollified by the back-tracking and running for cover that's happenned so far, and enjoying every minute of it.
Quig; please feel free to choose any, or all of the following in response to your fiendishly subtle (sigh) baiting:
Damn - but your lack of a 15 paragraph rebuttal of any of this or backup to your pissing and moaning still means you have nothing but humor to fall back on.
Emmet my boy (and you will have to excuse my patronage of a youngster), it was you that posted this thread. This thread that courted suspicion over the commitment of the team principal. But you didn’t check your story, did you?
There was no mention of Paul being detained in Melbourne on Doctor’s advice, was there? It’s the first GP that he hasn’t attended since he owned the team and was down to Doctor’s advice. I wonder who else in the paddock can claim an attendance record that good?
Then there is this nonsense about not being in Faenza enough. OK, might have merit, let’s look into it. No, can’t do that because even the people that were there can’t agree on what it was that was being said, or even which echelon of the organization it came from.
Never mind that cause we then get treated to a lecture on the efficacy of military leadership and discipline. Bad move.
I detect that more than a few of our members have had an experience (some voluntarily, some no) in the service of their country’s armed forces. Some will recall fun and adventure, comradeship that isn’t replicated elsewhere, a sense of purpose and worth, professionalism supported by adequate funding, and an unshakeable belief that the way we do things is the right way, the only way.
Some may also be reminded of the tediousness and limitations imposed by a strictly hierarchal system of management. How its linearity suppresses individual thought and punishes independence and innovation. How it demands conformity in all things.
Some may (indeed do) think that this is the way things should be but succeed only in subliminally acknowledging that being solely responsible for a decision that is made without reference to a strict set of rules just doesn’t suit them.
And some are reminded that in order to achieve their goals and to feel their worth, that they needed ultimately to take responsibility for their actions and decisions. That a rigid set of rules, and the knowledge that there is always someone further up the line on whom the axe will fall when it hits the fan, not only leaves them intellectually unfulfilled, but also often falls short of achieving the desired result.
If they’re smart, these people will add the military authority and management system to the pantheon of experience that helps to guide them when making decisions. And what they will always do is to question themselves as to whether they have made a good decision. In doing so, they will improve.
So I don’t know whether criticising Stoddie’s attendance at a Grand Prix, or his esteem among the Faenza factory hands (themselves no doubt unable to overcome the culture shock of the boss’s enthicity) is useful.
I’m absolutely sure that semi-successful business types ticking off success factors and problem solving formulae that are learnt rote in the most basic of business schools contribute bugger all to the health of the debate.
And I KNOW that military-style leadership is a sure-fire way to ruin a business. That much has been proved many-a-time in the past.
So where exactly do you reckon that you’ve won Quig?
Pops - or should it be just a simple hey Old Man...?
Your early onset CRS syndrome is starting to show. You might want to get back on your meds or have the dosage increased.
You state:
This thread that courted suspicion over the commitment of the team principal. But you didn’t check your story, did you?
No it did not court suspicion over PS's commitment. Oh, and I did check my story. Get your reading glasses on.
First - I started this thread but I was not the first to run this story. It was Minardus who first brought it to the attention of the board. In both my thread as well as his mention of the story the line about PS being sideliuned by health concerns was clearly mentioned.
Read the last sentence of the first paragraph then attempt to back your claim up.
Minardus' post was in the Minardi vs. Jordaninski thread. No complaint from you on that one. The only thing I am guilty of is being happy that GCM was able to help out. Any implication or suspicion over loyalty or commitment falls well and truly on you.
As far as your assertion that the not enough time spent in Faenza deserving
"might have merit, let's look into it"
You should have stopped there. Your weak attempt at casting doubt over the source(s)is pretty limp. Had the claims all been identical you would have claimed it was contrived.
You then continue on with this:
Never mind that cause we then get treated to a lecture on the efficacy of military leadership and discipline. Bad move.
Wrong again gramps. I did relate to Oz - tha sanest member of the Croc Dundee community here on FM.com (sorry for dooming you bro) - in terms that we are both familiar with about HIS post.
My comments to Roo - no mention of military leadership.
Your paragraphs 6,7,8 and 9 are well written but really have no weight in this thread. That being said what well respected "Lease" thread would be complete without fine wordsmithing.
Para 10 - well we'll get back to that one.
So I don’t know whether criticising Stoddie’s attendance at a Grand Prix
Who did? Certainly not me. As a matter of fact I praise him (PS) in this thread for sending GCM to help out. You are projecting again. Could it be that YOU have an issue with this?
Finally - you state:
And I KNOW that military-style leadership is a sure-fire way to ruin a business.
Please define military style leadership?
I, for one, know of MANY forms of "Military style leadership" They vary with the individual, the situation the skill level and motivation of the led as well as many other factors. You even state in Para 10 that the combination of lessons learned in the military and modified for use in the business world was a good thing.
well, my two cents is,...... lets say hes at the factory 2 days a month, and in a month there is usually 2-3 races, each consisting of friday sat sun, which if my math is ok is 3 days, leading to 6-9 days a month. lets take an average of say 7 days a month at races. travel time, would be i guess at least an additional day a race, so then we have 9 days a month where he is travelling to, or at races, and two days at the factory. this means 11 days a month commited to f1. So, for what its worth, stoddarts total commitment to f1 seems to represent a considerable amount of his time. i would also like to add that i believe tese numbers to be totally conservative as they dont include two seater events, the limited testing we do and other such stuff.
That point asside, of course it is important to lead by example, however hes not a technical guy so how much can he lead at the factory? on the other hand if hes lack of presence stops the budget we have being used fluidly and causes bottlenecks in the deveopment/construction/logistic process that would need to be urgently adressed. I do think he sets an example by being passionate, always* present and always fighting for minardi, putting his own cola on the line etc.
could the comment be a mixture of frustration at the performance (until the point in time of minardi?) im not sure anymore if the comment was made before or after the debut of the PS05. could be culture could be anything.
I was in the air training corp, so i would condier myself to be an expert in the field of masturbatio, i mean leadership.
As for the scouts, I was raised a catholic, so i got my quota of sexually bizarre situations without joing the scouts.
well, my profession is based entirely around false assumtions, so i guess YES. im probably 80% lease, 20% crazy yankee to be more accurate. in my post i acknowledge some important popints i beleive, however even if i wanted to agree with you i dont know if i could after that post about the scouts, it just discredits the whole thread. dont worry i still have love for you, but its just plutonic.
I forgot to mention, i have a scheme about rainsing money i hit on while travelling from hamburg to a dam. the pods are white. cocaine is white. paint the pods with cocaine, fly it to a country where its dearer, and sell it at profit. or do it like BAR with an extra 'fuel' tank. at least we know know whats really in those funny tubes going into the helmet.
you can be very condescending when your angry, is that a badge you can earn in the scouts?:P
Comments
other than that, I think PS is the best, just because he looks cool :cool:
People in this very forum converse to each other from all corners of the globe, why can't these blokes do it between Italy and England?
Ever heard of the telephone, internet or heaven forbid, video conferencing?
Oh Lease Stop banging the Kangaroos. Look for a more fullfilling relationship It's sure to give you a better outlook on life. (I'm not talking about moving on to sheep either)
A command decision Quig, well done. We all know what happens to the bloke on point.
It has not gone on too long.
I am well mollified by the back-tracking and running for cover that's happenned so far, and enjoying every minute of it.
Go boys, go!
Why don't you give us your all knowing input on what needs to be done in order to sort this situation.
- Stick it up yer arse
- Don't know if it needs fixing (see Monaco thread)
- Move it, move the lot of it to Sydney. Hell, half of Italy's already moved there anyway.
- Blanket ban on smoking in the UK
- Get someone in Faenza to learn to speak proper Orrstrayen
- Whisper 'Air Faenza' in Stoddart's ear while he's sleeping
- Get the Toad to sponsor Stoddart's membership application at the Maranello Country Club
- Tell Stoddart that Used Car Yards in Northern Italy are easy meat
There's gotta be heaps more.
Lease, we need to talk...
Back from the scout jamboree?
Are you serious?
Emmet my boy (and you will have to excuse my patronage of a youngster), it was you that posted this thread. This thread that courted suspicion over the commitment of the team principal. But you didn’t check your story, did you?
There was no mention of Paul being detained in Melbourne on Doctor’s advice, was there? It’s the first GP that he hasn’t attended since he owned the team and was down to Doctor’s advice. I wonder who else in the paddock can claim an attendance record that good?
Then there is this nonsense about not being in Faenza enough. OK, might have merit, let’s look into it. No, can’t do that because even the people that were there can’t agree on what it was that was being said, or even which echelon of the organization it came from.
Never mind that cause we then get treated to a lecture on the efficacy of military leadership and discipline. Bad move.
I detect that more than a few of our members have had an experience (some voluntarily, some no) in the service of their country’s armed forces. Some will recall fun and adventure, comradeship that isn’t replicated elsewhere, a sense of purpose and worth, professionalism supported by adequate funding, and an unshakeable belief that the way we do things is the right way, the only way.
Some may also be reminded of the tediousness and limitations imposed by a strictly hierarchal system of management. How its linearity suppresses individual thought and punishes independence and innovation. How it demands conformity in all things.
Some may (indeed do) think that this is the way things should be but succeed only in subliminally acknowledging that being solely responsible for a decision that is made without reference to a strict set of rules just doesn’t suit them.
And some are reminded that in order to achieve their goals and to feel their worth, that they needed ultimately to take responsibility for their actions and decisions. That a rigid set of rules, and the knowledge that there is always someone further up the line on whom the axe will fall when it hits the fan, not only leaves them intellectually unfulfilled, but also often falls short of achieving the desired result.
If they’re smart, these people will add the military authority and management system to the pantheon of experience that helps to guide them when making decisions. And what they will always do is to question themselves as to whether they have made a good decision. In doing so, they will improve.
So I don’t know whether criticising Stoddie’s attendance at a Grand Prix, or his esteem among the Faenza factory hands (themselves no doubt unable to overcome the culture shock of the boss’s enthicity) is useful.
I’m absolutely sure that semi-successful business types ticking off success factors and problem solving formulae that are learnt rote in the most basic of business schools contribute bugger all to the health of the debate.
And I KNOW that military-style leadership is a sure-fire way to ruin a business. That much has been proved many-a-time in the past.
So where exactly do you reckon that you’ve won Quig?
(15 paragraphs with a little cheating)
Your early onset CRS syndrome is starting to show. You might want to get back on your meds or have the dosage increased.
You state: No it did not court suspicion over PS's commitment. Oh, and I did check my story. Get your reading glasses on.
First - I started this thread but I was not the first to run this story. It was Minardus who first brought it to the attention of the board. In both my thread as well as his mention of the story the line about PS being sideliuned by health concerns was clearly mentioned.
Read the last sentence of the first paragraph then attempt to back your claim up.
Minardus' post was in the Minardi vs. Jordaninski thread. No complaint from you on that one. The only thing I am guilty of is being happy that GCM was able to help out. Any implication or suspicion over loyalty or commitment falls well and truly on you.
As far as your assertion that the not enough time spent in Faenza deserving
"might have merit, let's look into it"
You should have stopped there. Your weak attempt at casting doubt over the source(s)is pretty limp. Had the claims all been identical you would have claimed it was contrived.
You then continue on with this: Wrong again gramps. I did relate to Oz - tha sanest member of the Croc Dundee community here on FM.com (sorry for dooming you bro) - in terms that we are both familiar with about HIS post.
My comments to Roo - no mention of military leadership.
Your paragraphs 6,7,8 and 9 are well written but really have no weight in this thread. That being said what well respected "Lease" thread would be complete without fine wordsmithing.
Para 10 - well we'll get back to that one. Who did? Certainly not me. As a matter of fact I praise him (PS) in this thread for sending GCM to help out. You are projecting again. Could it be that YOU have an issue with this?
Finally - you state: Please define military style leadership?
I, for one, know of MANY forms of "Military style leadership" They vary with the individual, the situation the skill level and motivation of the led as well as many other factors. You even state in Para 10 that the combination of lessons learned in the military and modified for use in the business world was a good thing.
lets say hes at the factory 2 days a month, and in a month there is usually 2-3 races, each consisting of friday sat sun, which if my math is ok is 3 days, leading to 6-9 days a month. lets take an average of say 7 days a month at races. travel time, would be i guess at least an additional day a race, so then we have 9 days a month where he is travelling to, or at races, and two days at the factory. this means 11 days a month commited to f1. So, for what its worth, stoddarts total commitment to f1 seems to represent a considerable amount of his time. i would also like to add that i believe tese numbers to be totally conservative as they dont include two seater events, the limited testing we do and other such stuff.
That point asside, of course it is important to lead by example, however hes not a technical guy so how much can he lead at the factory? on the other hand if hes lack of presence stops the budget we have being used fluidly and causes bottlenecks in the deveopment/construction/logistic process that would need to be urgently adressed. I do think he sets an example by being passionate, always* present and always fighting for minardi, putting his own cola on the line etc.
could the comment be a mixture of frustration at the performance (until the point in time of minardi?) im not sure anymore if the comment was made before or after the debut of the PS05. could be culture could be anything.
I was in the air training corp, so i would condier myself to be an expert in the field of masturbatio, i mean leadership.
As for the scouts, I was raised a catholic, so i got my quota of sexually bizarre situations without joing the scouts.
=> Im with roo/lease on this one.
You may want to think about this one.
I forgot to mention, i have a scheme about rainsing money i hit on while travelling from hamburg to a dam. the pods are white. cocaine is white. paint the pods with cocaine, fly it to a country where its dearer, and sell it at profit. or do it like BAR with an extra 'fuel' tank. at least we know know whats really in those funny tubes going into the helmet.
you can be very condescending when your angry, is that a badge you can earn in the scouts?:P
[Edited on 24/5/2005 by HAND_SOLO]
'catholic Scouting'
sounds more like a peverse sexual excercise involving boys
where does that leave you? Prison in most countries
[Edited on 24/5/2005 by HAND_SOLO]
Not to you Quig, sorry. Warm regards will always persist, but ya just aint adding anything new.
No, in this case I have been bested by fiendishly clever and subtle irony and must withdraw from the field.
Handjob's three-post set should be retained in the hall of fame of posting, but the last one is a special: It would be rude to go on after that.